Mst Can Cause a Card to Resolve Without Effect Usually Works on Continuous Spellstraps Tho

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MST is Spell Speed 2. If activated say on sayy... smashing ground, it would destroy and negate it because smashing ground is Spell Speed 1 and MST = SS2. and in the rule book it goes backwords so smashing ground gets destroyed before its effect is activated.

Buuuuuut if it is activated on a card such as dust tornado, which is a trap......??? 94.10.124.191 (talk) 19:21, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

That is actually not true. MST only destroys cards, it does not negate their effect. The spell may be sent to the graveyard but the effect will always stay on the field. Only cards that specifically say "negate" in the text can negate, such as seven tools, magic drain, or starlight road. MST can also destroy both spell and trap cards, however the only case in which it is able to negate is when it is chained to a continous spell or trap, which must stay on the field for their effect to work. In the case of dust tornado, it will be destoryed by MST but it can be chained by the user to destroy one of your set spell/trap before dust dies to MST...unless it was just set by the user, in which case it just dies. Chowlick (talk • contribs) 19:41, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

yeh but what happened to spell speed.

MST will destroy and negate most cards cos of spell speed. —This unsigned comment was made by 94.10.124.191 (talk • contribs)

No.

For example

CL 1: Smashing Ground

CL 2: Mystical Space Typhoon on Smashing Ground

Resolve!

CL 2: Mystical Space Typhoon destroys the -card- Smashing Ground

CL 1: the -EFFECT- Smashing Ground destroys a monster

effects aren't usually 'attached' to the card they come from, after they have been activated.

ie: if you Trap Hole Caius the Shadow Monarch, his target is still Removed from play.

-Resk (talk • contribs) 20:14, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

hm. but since they resolve backwords and MST is a faster play card, thenit should destroy SG before its effect takes place.

1. Play SG 2. Counter with MST

=

1. MST effect targets SG and destroys it. 2. SG destroyed. 3. effect would have gone here. but SG is no longer on the field. —This unsigned comment was made by 94.10.124.191 (talk • contribs)

Think of MST as Raigeki Break, except it can only destroy Spell and Trap Cards. MST does not negate cards. It just destroys them. I have done this countless times in the video games and MST does NOT negate cards.

However, MST does stop the effect of activated Field Spells and Continuous Spells and Traps before they resolve. (Although it technically does not negate them)

For example:

My opponent Synchro Summons Stardust Dragon
I activate my face-down Royal Oppression
I use the effect immediately, paying 800 Life Points to negate the summon.
My opponent chains with MST, targeting Royal Oppression.
MST resolves first destroying Royal Oppression.
Since Royal Oppression was not on the field after resolution, Royal Oppression does not negate the summon.
Mark Mares (talk • contribs) 20:33, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

As Dest had said, the effects for spells and even traps are not attached. Even if they are Destroyed, the "ghost" of the effect will stay on the field always...unless it is specifically Negated. This is just the way they are and is something that you just MUST accept for what it is, as it is a fundamental rule of the game. Chowlick (talk • contribs) 20:35, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

and i mean Resk x/ Chowlick (talk • contribs) 20:37, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

so what is the point of spell speeds ?

and if what u r saying is true, then is there a quick play spell card out there which negates and destroys a spell or trap card on the field. —This unsigned comment was made by 94.10.124.191 (talk • contribs)

The point of the Spell Speeds is to know what card can be chained to another. They also have a small use on SEGOC sometimes. ATEMVEGETA (Talk) 21:04, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

in tournies, MST is considered to negate as well. so is dust tornado —This unsigned comment was made by 94.10.124.191 (talk • contribs)

No, no its not. Jon Kovacs (talk • contribs) 21:39, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

try it 94.10.124.191 (talk) 21:43, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah I'm not sure where you got that it does that in tourneys.....then you must have realllyy bad judges and players at the tourney or someone just gave you really false information. And on negating spells/traps, there are only usually counter traps that does that, like I said in the begining, seven tools, magic drain, solemn judgment, etc. There are few quick plays that negate specific spells/traps, such as "My body as a shield," but that is the only example I can think of at the moment. Chowlick (talk • contribs) 21:46, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

Why don't you try any Konami's PC Game like Joey The Passion, etc... and use your MTS againt your opponent's Monster Reborn or any non-Continuous Spell/Trap Card. You will see that card can't be negated by MST--Lê (talk • contribs) 23:06, January 23, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, try simulating on an official software game. I know 2007 and 2008 World Championship on the DS will not allow you to negate. They just destroy. I guarantee you it won't work.

This has ALWAYS been the case. Even when the game recently came out. To anyone who sincerely played a MST on my activated Mirror Force, I just usually gave a golf clap and said "Congratulations".

The ONLY time you can STOP a Spell/Trap using Dust Tornado or MST is if you activate it and target the card during the turn it is SET face-down, since they cannot activate them that turn. Waiting until after the end of the turn may end badly, since it could be chain-able like a Waboku. Activating a MST after the fact a card has activated is too late.

then why is there so much... confusion among yugioh players about cards like DT and MST 94.10.124.191 (talk) 22:34, January 24, 2011 (UTC)

Because people usually start playing before they know all the rules, so they spread the lack of knowladge, as they don't initially understand the difference between Negate & Destroy-Resk (talk • contribs) 22:50, January 24, 2011 (UTC)

you attack with a monster card an your opponent activated scrape-iron scacrow, you chain mystical space typhon and target scrape-iron scacrow, mystical space typhon destroy scrape iron scracrow, scrape iron scarecrow still resolve by negating the attack, because scrape iron scarecrow is no-longer on the field when it resolve it does not return face-down in your spell and trap card zone.

The only quick play spell that negate the activation is my body as a shield.96.44.82.53 (talk) 00:29, January 25, 2011 (UTC)

And Jar Robber--Lê (talk • contribs) 01:45, January 25, 2011 (UTC)

That card isn't usable, considering Pot of Greed is banned. Jon Kovacs (talk • contribs) 01:48, January 25, 2011 (UTC)

If you use a face-up royal oppresion to negated the special summon of a monster you and your opponent cannot activated mystical space typhon or dust tournado.96.44.82.53 (talk) 20:28, January 26, 2011 (UTC)

Yes they can. both as Spell Speed 2, and the effect of a cont' trap dissapears if destroyed.-Resk (talk • contribs) 20:34, January 26, 2011 (UTC)

Let's just put this to rest: unless the card outright states that they negate the activation and effect of something when it destroys it, the effect does not get negated. The reason why cards like Equip and Field spells and Continuous Trap cards aren't applied when they're destroyed by MST or Dust Tornado when they're activated is because they need to remain on the field for their effect to apply, hence why they're designed to stay on the field. Normal Spells and Traps and Quick-Play Spells are designed to be used and tossed, so they do NOT need to stay on the field after activating for their effects to go through. MST and Dust Tornado do not say that they negate the effect, so they do not negate the effect, period. And spell speeds have nothing to do with it; spell speeds are only used to determine whether or not a card can be chained to another, that's all. 66.228.109.2 (talk) 20:35, January 26, 2011 (UTC)

The reason why mystical space typhon and dust tournado cannot be activated is not because of spell speed, when you negate the summon of a monster you must negate it before it is succesfuly summon, and mystical space typon cannot be use before a monster is succesfuly summon as well as dust tournado.96.44.82.53 (talk) 21:03, January 26, 2011 (UTC)

They can, as they are being used in response to the activation of the effect of Royal Oppression, else you're saying that Solemn Warning couldn't be negated by Counter Counter.-Resk (talk • contribs) 21:19, January 26, 2011 (UTC)

The way you saying thing means it would be valid to chain mystical space typhon in respond to nutrient z that is been activated during the damage calculation just because it start a chain, this is not right however seven tool of the bandit,and trap jammer can negated the activation of nutrient z and also quick effect of a monster like majestic stardragon, and stardust dragon/assault mode even tho they are speed two.96.44.82.53 (talk) 23:30, January 26, 2011 (UTC)

th idea of after effects or ghost effects makes no sense.

why would mst and or DT be a staple in basicly every deck anyone makes and most starter and structure decks?

if it is destroyed before it successfully apply its effect then it is negated.

thats why jinzo cant be played with solemn judgement activated. 94.11.144.45 (talk) 23:00, February 1, 2011 (UTC)

You fail at logic, I'm sorry to say. Just because it can't do what you want it to, doesn't mean that it is a useless card. And also, Jinzo loses to Solemn Judgement because Solemn Judgement's effect has a higher Spell Speed. Jon Kovacs (talk • contribs) 23:24, February 1, 2011 (UTC)

not because of that, he looses because he never hits the field for his effect being applied... that has nothing to do with spell speeds. -dest- (talk • contribs) 23:49, February 1, 2011 (UTC)

I used the wrong argument, sorry about that. However, the point still stands, that MST does not negate anything. Jon Kovacs (talk • contribs) 00:13, February 2, 2011 (UTC)

@94.11.144.45: Just play any Konami's Yu-Gi-Oh! game!!! Solemn Judgement say " NEGATE the activation of a Spell Card / Trap Card / Normal Summon / Flip Summon / Special Summon and destroy the Spell Card, Trap Card, or Summoned monster", so it can negate summon of Jinzo. MST say "Select 1 Spell or Trap Card on the field. Destroy it", just destroy, not negate. That why Solemn Judgement's text have word " NEGATE "--Lê (talk • contribs) 00:59, February 2, 2011 (UTC)

right. so how can someone counter the opponents spell/traps?

As silly as it sounds, counter traps are usually the true way of countering.

As mentioned many times in this thread, most counter traps state NEGATE on them meaning it negates the effect of said card.

MST and dust tornado are handy at destroying cards before they can be activated (primarily traps set that turn) or can be used to force activations early which messes up the opponents original plan.

As for staples, don't be drawn in that you must have MST and dust tornadoes in every deck. ie Exodia deck.

So if you want negation in your deck, use seven tools or magic jammer etc.

Bruce 90.209.27.43 (talk) 21:42, February 2, 2011 (UTC)

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Source: https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Forum:We_all_know_MST_negates_as_well_as_destroys_%28SS2%29

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